Talk:Wrapsodi Skuttla, Malicious Potion-Maker (3.5e Vestige)

Ratings

Ganteka Future opposes this article and rated it 0 of 4.

Wow. WOW. I read this out-loud and... it's really terrible and dumb and not balanced and just way too much of everything. It also amazingly displays a lack of knowledge on what vestiges are and how they work. There's so much here that it's basically non-functional fluff-wise for everyone else other than the author. A drider-vestige isn't a terrible idea to give you spider powers or whatever, but this is just a mess. Also, a lot of the flavor is confusing and in poor taste.

Power Level

That look like a 6th level vestige not a 8th level one. As for brew twisted potion, well I will need to address it on it own page. --Leziad (talk) 20:53, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Eh? How is it not an 8th-level vestige? I'm aiming for that power level because Wrapsodi should be difficult to contact; after all, her soul was ground to dust. --Luigifan18 (talk) 16:34, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

It just... not 8th level. It like how fireball isn't a 7th level spell. Also how bad someone got trounced don't make them easier or harder to bind, in fact that pretty similar to what most vestiges experienced. --Leziad (talk) 16:42, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

So you can see some of the things that befell vestiges, their level, and their DC: Biblos, sealed into an artifact book, then the universe ended (1st, DC 15); Biokaryota, soul was completely devoured after its universe was completely devoured (5th (possibly 4th, level discussion has been had), DC 28); Faith, simultaneously did and did not die (5th, DC 26); Melusine, was removed from the possibility of existing (6th, DC 25); The Shadow, never existed (3rd, DC 20); Whitechapel, got devoured by several elder things at the same time (2nd, DC 20). Power level,method of destruction, and and binding DC are not really related. --Undead_Knave (talk) 14:31, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

The binding DC typically represent how willing a vestige is to make a good pact, some vestiges want a lot of control while other are more lax. The level is just how powerful a vestige is, right now for 8th it not impressive. You could get control over time and space and the ability to call death from the heavens, split yourself into two and get a really powerful axe and mount, and immunities, etherealness and some powerful assorted ability. This one gets you moderetely high speed bonus and skirmish, a weak bite with a posion everyone is immune to at that level, a feat that lost a lot of it usefulness with flight being a thing, a feat that lost most of it usefullness at high bab and an item crafting feat with some assorted abilities. Remember that vestige are not an expandable resources, so their level really only represent when they should become accessible. It perfectly fine to scale vestiges with binder level, in fact it encouraged to do so. I really don't see why you couldn't bind wrapsodi starting at level 11th, or even 7th.

Oh and before you do, adding more abilities and bigger number won't make her 8th. It will just make her broken, as I mentioned the level is only when she should first become accessible, they should still be sensible number wise. --Leziad (talk) 16:33, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

LOOK OUT!!!!!

I see you are preparing to make a Yahweh deity.

Recommendation: DON'T PLEASE.

I don't know if you remember the age of Archetyper, but for the love of god, please, PLEASE, DO NOT. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 05:06, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

I've only heard of the guy through the discussion of social combat. --Luigifan18 (talk) 14:03, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

A contributor whose article were so controversial and spiteful when he left we ended up wiping off all his remaining article, user page and user talk. One of the thing he did was making Yahweh a LE rapist, it wasn't the worst thing he thing. --Leziad (talk) 14:19, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Going to bed, but one post before I do. There is a saying you don't discuss two things in public: Religion and Politics. For good reason. It's highly recommended to stay far far faaar away from any religious figures of considerable size, especially those who have say a billion differing views on how it's supposed to be, and who tend to ruffle feathers a lot. Trust me, better men have tried and failed. Even I won't touch it. Trust me, abandon all hope of it. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 14:24, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Know what I do if an article bothers me? I throw a massive tantrum and claim that I'm being oppressed while demanding reparations, hate crime laws, and people stepping down act like an adult and close the tab. If someone can't do that, then it's not really anyone's problem but their own. Most people who take bait are only doing it for attention anyway. LenKagetsu (talk) 17:11, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

While that is true, I prefer our wiki take a nonpolitical nonreligious stand and if that mean not tackling some articles I am fine with that. Not withstanding that Yahweh is a complex figure who is seen very differently by very real group with very strong feelings about how he is represented. Beside which Yahweh are we talking about? The one with a son? The one without one? The one who live near the star Kolob? A weird amalgam between all of them? I don't know, it seem making an article about the big G isn't worth it. With that said I won't stop Luigifan from writing it if he feels like it, I will rate it if I feel strongly about it, which is possible depending on how it written. --Leziad (talk) 17:24, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

On Fluff

I'm having difficulty telling what's going on, because unlike Optica (which is fairly devoid of fluff) this one is drowning in it. It's too long.

I'll go through it and try to summarize later, but why does it read like bad fanfiction? You are apparently a character (that poor child, why did their mother name them an internet name?) and things are all meta, and something something religion?

I haven't gotten to its actual mechanics, but I'll trust Leziad if he says its overleveled. Rather, I'll ask what exactly is going on with this thing. What is it in four sentences or less?

Also...

"or stabbing a pregnant woman in the gut (and murdering her baby in the process). "

Classy. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 10:01, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

"Luigifan" is actually a pseudonym, not the character's birth name. The reason why he took that pseudonym is pretty much a huge joke aimed at the fourth wall.

And yes, Wrapsodi really is (or was) that much of an asshole. She would straight-up murder people just to laugh at the misery of their families. She's not supposed to be likeable; there's a reason she's one of the few villains the Heroes' League had no qualms with just straight-up trying to kill, despite the group's usual preference of not committing murder and trying to promote a "crime doesn't pay" message to discourage evil in a less violent way. And that reason is that, quite simply, she has no sensible or sympathetic motivations for her actions. She's just an asshole who loved watching other people suffer.

(Selfishness is, in my view, a fundamental component of evil, but insufficient to deserve the label of "evil" all by itself. Indeed, it's not selfishness that's evil so much as a callous disregard for the well-being of others. Sadism, which I define as enjoying the suffering of others so much that you go out of your way to cause suffering, especially when you don't make any sort of profit from your cruel actions, does deserve the label of "evil" and also pretty much marks you as not deserving to live. (You will notice that my definition of "sadism" includes pretty much every bully ever; this isn't an accident.) I hate greed, too, but I don't begrudge profit-seeking if it isn't taken to excessive levels.) --Luigifan18 (talk) 20:48, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Summary

Summaries are meant to be a short one or two sentences. You have a paragraph here. Include less in the summary. Keep this in mind for later as well. --Ganteka Future (talk) 02:52, 15 December 2015 (UTC)